Unexplained email about transactions at NS&I

Tbh, i don’t really know what the term means fully had to google it. Funny how i ended up back at curve community with my results: Cash recycling limits and tests - #2 by Gaoler
Explains it here a little.

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I think it’s fairly obvious what has happened. Its a response to Creation blocking Curve transactions a couple of weeks ago which clearly has Curve extremely worried that other card issuers may follow suit. I think Curve management has to think very carefully about the opportunities for abuse that the product has opened up, and be much more proactive around shutting down any situations that are likely to backfire on them. Its inevitably a tricky balance to do that without making the product unattractive, or pissing off your customers.

Personally I don’t think this kind of blanket email is the right answer. I have bought NS&I investments through Curve as investments, and either still have them, or the case of income bonds bought last year kept them until I otherwise would have cashed them in anyway (when NS&I slashed the rate on them). I’ve done that because Curve makes it possible and it is within the terms and conditions, and I would expect the majority of people who have bought NS&I investments to be in that position. There clearly have been a (significant?) minority of people cash recycling, in some cases to extreme extents if you believe what you read, so it’s not really surprising it’s come to a head.

If Curve wants to stop or limit NS&I transactions they can. So surely it would be much better to enforce clear rules, not accuse customers of ‘suspected’ terms breaches?

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Unfortunately (from what I’ve heard from speaking to colleagues and reading on here) Curve seem to have sent this email out to all customers rather than only those that have used NS&I - if there was a desire to send such an email I would have (a) expected it to have been more carefully worded (without such an accusing tone) and (b) sent out either in a more focused manner or with a more generic message.

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All UK customers, that would be (luckily for Curve). I (living in the Netherlands) didn’t receive the email.

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Eh, it was a bit of an unfriendly email. I do stash my tax in NS&I until it’s requested by HMRC in January/June, but it’s hardly ‘cash recycling’. I assumed it was an allowed use of the card?

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Just taken a snippet from Curve’s ‘Terms of Service’ it states:

  • for “cash recycling”, which means using your Curve card to make an ATM withdrawal and using the cash to repay the payment card used for the withdrawal in order to receive rewards on the payment card or your Curve card

There is no mention of NS&I in the terms about cash recycling. Confused even more now. Don’t see how ATM’s have anything to do with NS&I

Also, have another definition of cash recycling, would make more sense i suppose.

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The bemusing point I make is: I have not used curve card for NS&I investments. How do they know I invest in them. They must be looking at my account to check what I’m up to. Why???

Secondly not the quickest to respond to these inquiries. Very amateurish. I think this has prompted me to cancel my curve card.

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Wait for a reply first my friend, could be a rational explanation for all this. Curve don’t seem to be the swiftest in replying.

Yep I received the e-mail. But I do actually use it with NS&I. Every month I buy some premium bonds with my spare salary using curve charging my underlying debit card which offers cashback on the transaction.

As far as I’m concerned that is standard use.

I have sometimes used a Credit Card, but this is rare, again though, I don’t see this as inappropriate use though I can see why people might be more concerned about revolving credit but isn’t that my affair as to if I pay off the bill or not… My thought would be if I screw myself over and am unable to pay my my credit card provider they would suspend my service preventing use with curve anyway.

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Yeah, I’m not remotely impressed with that email. It’s been 9+ months since any transactions with NS&I and these were funded from an underlying debit card and fully traceable.

Once again Curve is jumping the gun with some blanket poorly-worded email that’s done nothing other than annoy the hell out of customers.

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Glad to hear it was at least UK-only, I was worried it had gone to all!

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I have made one purchase of Premium Bonds for £100 with Curve Fronted on my metal card. Curve support even helped me as I couldn’t get it to work (through my error)

A month later I get the email accusing me of multiple uses for cash recycling

Curve customer service really isn’t very clever, hacking of customers using Fronted EXACTLY how they’ve advertised it!

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I got this email too. Have to say I’m really hacked off at Curve - an implication I was doing something wrong, and a threat to close down my Curve Account? Things like this dent this customer’s loyalty!

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Also had this email, replied to support explaining no recycling has happened.

My support reply now gives me 10 days to supply all bank statements, all card statements, all NS&I statements. If I don’t provide this this will close my account.

This is after I proactively responded to their threat email. Pretty poor customer relations, investor relations and seems to just be a “mail all” based on any NS&I. No explanation for starting a countdown on me for emailing in to confirm I’ve not done what they claim…

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To be fair, looking at how Curve has dealt with communications in the past, I wouldn’t expect any less than an email blast of this kind.

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Ah I just saw this. I received the same and am baffled by this.

Very bizarre I got an email then saying this. I never did any cash recycling nor understand why I am getting this email months later…

Hi all,

Very confused to have an email about possible suspected breach (Cash recycling) just for buying NS&I premium bonds (When it was allowed via curve). I thought it was allowed to buy bonds provided you pay off your underlying card and the money is being used for a purpose. E.g. I was intending to save it up to max the bonds out.

I find I am questioning if I get emails like this, why would you use a credit card underlying for anything, Curve fronted appears to do nothing for me anymore if I get dodgy emails like this.

To add, the last time I even did this was in July (Months ago) and never done since, nor will in the future. However, all very baffling…

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Hey everyone, thanks for the healthy discussion on this here and I’m sorry for any confusion caused by this email- I’m here to clear that confusion up!

First off, I can confirm that our team made a mistake when bulk selecting which customers this email should be sent to which means that the email’s contents won’t apply to all Curve users who received the email. Speaking on behalf of Curve, we’re very sorry for this error and are working to contact the recipients of this email to clarify this mistake as fast as possible.

In the meantime, if you’re unsure whether the email’s contents applied to you and your spending or not, please get in touch with our support team just in case by raising a ticket in the Curve app- the support team can then check there if they need to discuss this further with you or simply owe you a big apology!

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@Social_Joel This is a relief, but I’ve now wasted over 2 hours finding credit card statements and pulling together emails defending myself against something Curve allowed…

Nor is NS&I or transactions within Cash Recycling terms. It isn’t an ATM withdrawal…

If those of us got this message back from support following the original email are we still in the Supposed naughty list? As I did, and still have no clue…

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It would have been more helpful if Curve clarified if NS&I transactions are completely banned by Curve.

Could @Curve_Joel please confirm?

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Agreed, if CURVE have an issue just BLOCK the transactions occurring in future. Not threaten everyone and confuse their own terms and fronting policy…

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